sunday times article on Rolex modifications

[Oceanklassik]

Excessive or not, it will depend on current context. How much difference is it now between a watch of the same model while one is normal while the other is a DLC/PVD version? Like some of the b&r models, Ball watches, hamilton, even seiko and steinhart. I believe averagely, the difference is between a price range of $1K & $2K? Unless you are talking about customization, a standard production of 'black' watches among a brand's watches should not be considered excessive at this point. So if ROLEX does indeed decide to produce, say for example, a "DLC/PVD DSSD" at this point, it shouldn't be priced anything above $3K. That means, if the normal ss model costs $13K, a 'black' version of it should be not more than $16K.

Coming back to a third party who is now providing such a service and the warranty of a modified watch now has become an obvious problem, any 'big' amount above the retail price of a ss model is considered excessive. The contention now is that ROLEX has not yet (or may be not at all) produced one such 'black' model so that third party can simply "hantam" a price.

[triton]

so i take it that you agree that based on today context, the cost of DLC/customization is about 2k which works out to be about 15% above what AD is selling.

that is why in future, should rolex produce DLC/customization of the watch, and the price difference between standard models and customization models is beyond 15% difference, i will say it is excessive. why? because someone sits on the board of swiss standard watchmaking institutions such as fondation Haute De La Haute Horlogerie says so.

a DLC DSSD by time and gems is listed as USD14k with 10% discount if done through bank transfer which works out to be USD12.6k. based on today conversion rate of approximately 1.22, it is ~SGD15.4k, based on latest rolex RRP of DSSD is SGD13433.

based on the price that AD sells vs the customization with DLC, the DLC work is ~SGD2k. i am not sure how much it cost to DLC a watch. if it is not proportionate to, then maybe DLC cost is less than 1K in order not to be considered excessive?

So if ROLEX does indeed decide to produce, say for example, a "DLC/PVD DSSD" at this point, it shouldn't be priced anything above $3K. That means, if the normal ss model costs $13K, a 'black' version of it should be not more than $16K.

[KuchingKu]

First, third party PVD cost around usd1200 (for Pam). Re-PVD by Richemont about 1.5k.

Your explanation of excessive is very valid but very often manufacturers don't play by such rules. They just use clever marketing. Take AP. They can PVD the same watch, limited it to 500 pieces, give it a fancy name, change colour of dial or needle....walah...mark up by 200%. Expert who sits on any board can say what they want but the pieces still fly. Look at Pam 339, use some carbon composite, throw in a nice giorni logo, limited 1000 piece....cost 2 times more than 292 for retail. But people still buy cos they think it can be sold for another 50% mark up. This is why condo price so high still got people cheong!

so i take it that you agree that based on today context, the cost of DLC/customization is about 2k which works out to be about 15% above what AD is selling.

that is why in future, should rolex produce DLC/customization of the watch, and the price difference between standard models and customization models is beyond 15% difference, i will say it is excessive. why? because someone sits on the board of swiss standard watchmaking institutions such as fondation Haute De La Haute Horlogerie says so.

[Darkangel]

First, third party PVD cost around usd1200 (for Pam). Re-PVD by Richemont about 1.5k.

Your explanation of excessive is very valid but very often manufacturers don't play by such rules. They just use clever marketing. Take AP. They can PVD the same watch, limited it to 500 pieces, give it a fancy name, change colour of dial or needle....walah...mark up by 200%. Expert who sits on any board can say what they want but the pieces still fly. Look at Pam 339, use some carbon composite, throw in a nice giorni logo, limited 1000 piece....cost 2 times more than 292 for retail. But people still buy cos they think it can be sold for another 50% mark up. This is why condo price so high still got people cheong!

Of course manufacturer's are not stupid mah...they also want to make the money but they don't want people to ride on them to earn money. If not... why is the article up on today's newspaper?

[kqxrlovesSpeedmasters]

Time n Gems is one of the cheaper watch customisers. If you buy say a Bamford Tudor Heritage Chrono it retails at $17800 with maybe 5% disc which is around 3 times the price of an actual Tudor Heritage Chrono. The cost of the PVD process is definitely not worth so much. For a Bamford DSSD it cost 23k$ I think...much much more than Time n Gems...

[seiko.citizen]

Same as car AD...they also won't honor warranty If car has been modified.

Even if Rolex makes their own PVD or special editions, they will still not honor anything that's been modified by third party. They have no reason for backing these companies like pro hunter and bramford.

But using the car example; if you modify the engine and the engine blows, the dealer will not honour warranty, on the other hand, if your brakes fail independently of your engine mods, the dealer cannot refuse to honour warranty.

can the same argument be used here with rolex (or any other watch maker?); because a PVD is cosmetic and in no way harms the mov't, can rolex legally refuse to honour warranty claims?

[KuchingKu]

Pal. May not be accurate in Singapore. There are a few insurers who has disclaimer that ANY modification would invalid the insurance. I heard of a friend who was refused claim by insurer for tinted windows...citing it impaired judgement.
Also got case of AD refused to repair engine issue due to bigger rims...citing the bigger rims put more stress on the axials...blah blah and indirectly hurt the engine.

So, rolex can surely say just be opening the case back could already constitute to movement failure.

But using the car example; if you modify the engine and the engine blows, the dealer will not honour warranty, on the other hand, if your brakes fail independently of your engine mods, the dealer cannot refuse to honour warranty.

can the same argument be used here with rolex (or any other watch maker?); because a PVD is cosmetic and in no way harms the mov't, can rolex legally refuse to honour warranty claims?

[urban_11]

there's no need to debate over this.
as the typical rolex are bore after some times,ppl still opt to go for these customize pieces.Its no longer affecting much on the wty part as today,there's so many watch repair centre in town which can offer authentic verification.So even if Rolex refuse to take in as they already mentioned,u can still go to these places.

[triton]

but cannot discount that there are people who want to customize and yet service their watches at RSC.

there's no need to debate over this.
as the typical rolex are bore after some times,ppl still opt to go for these customize pieces.Its no longer affecting much on the wty part as today,there's so many watch repair centre in town which can offer authentic verification.So even if Rolex refuse to take in as they already mentioned,u can still go to these places.

[116520]

I wonder where Bamford, etc got their Rolex from... isn't it a win-win situation for Rolex since these companies purchase Rolexes first before selling it to their customers? Why Rolex want to come out this article to "discourage" those people who have too much money in their pocket to buy those watches???

[3kingdom]

I believe same applies to electronic products. Warranty stickers torn, warranty void.
But I am just curious, how an external PVD coating will affect the watch mechanism/movement
Anyway, the brand owner is the king and has the last say

[Watcha]

Companies always I do can, you do cannot. Or at least officially.
They can always chop the source with will.

As for the cars, so much for business ethics here. Might as well refuse claim if a sunglass is found in car.
Or owner have no 6/6 vision.

As what Bro Triton says about excessive. It doesnt seems so.
Small runs, business risks, marketing, distribution.

There will be buyers who are unfazed by price. Too much hassle send watch to pvd.
Better than those endless limited editions that are basically little mods at 3x price.
So are those worth the work done?

[kenlinliu1419]

i don't know how pvd coating is really done, but my basic engineering knowledge tells me that the movement, dial, etc. has to be removed from the casing before it can be done. maybe some kind bros can confirm this.

if that was the case, then i think the possibilities of damage or modification to the movement is high, thus the reason rolex give for voiding the warranty.

[Darkangel]

i don't know how pvd coating is really done, but my basic engineering knowledge tells me that the movement, dial, etc. has to be removed from the casing before it can be done. maybe some kind bros can confirm this.

if that was the case, then i think the possibilities of damage or modification to the movement is high, thus the reason rolex give for voiding the warranty.

Yes the movement and dial/parts has to be removed.

[triton]

sorry. don't understand what you mean

As what Bro Triton says about excessive. It doesnt seems so.
Small runs, business risks, marketing, distribution.